A friend of mine was asking me last night whether I had any regrets about never marrying, especially since I had such awesome Christian female friends like her. I thought about it, and I thought that maybe it is better to not have married, especially when I read stories about how family courts trample over the rights of men to favor women, regardless of what the law says.
The story is from one of Canada’s national newspapers, the National Post:
A wealthy businessman will have to pay more than $50,000 a month in spousal support for 10 years to a woman with whom he had a long-term romantic relationship even though they kept separate homes and had no children together, Ontario’s top court has ruled.
Under Ontario law, an unmarried couple are considered common-law spouses if they have cohabited — lived together in a conjugal relationship — continuously for at least three years. But that doesn’t necessarily mean living in the same home, the court found.
[…]When their 14-year relationship finally broke down in May 2015, Climans asked the courts to recognize her as Latner’s spouse and order him to pay her support. He argued she had been a travel companion and girlfriend, nothing more. As such, he said, they were never legally spouses and he owed no support. An eight-day trial ensued.
In her decision in February 2019, Superior Court Justice Sharon Shore sided with Climans. She ruled they were in fact long-time spouses, finding that despite their separate home, they lived under one roof at Latner’s cottage for part of the summer, and during winter vacations in Florida. Shore ordered him to pay her $53,077 monthly indefinitely.
The judge ordered him to pay her $53,077 per moth, indefinitely. Elsewhere in the article, we learn that he had asked her to sign a pre-nuptial agreement many times, and each time she refused. (Those are not even enforced fairly by the way) She wanted his money, and the judge made sure she got it. Because the law doesn’t matter in a family court.
So, what I wanted to point out about this is the fact that a female judge decided to bend the law in order to favor a woman. And this sort of thing happens A LOT in Canada – where their female judges are notorious for progressive judicial activism, e.g. Beverley Mclachlin, Bertha Wilson, Claire L’Heureux-Dubé, etc. Ontario family courts are notoriously anti-male, and men know this.
But it’s not just Ontario. I have two Christian friends who married their Christian wives as virgins, and then their wives divorced them. I heard what happened to them in divorce court. Again, female lawyers and female judges disregarded the law in order to punish the man and favor the woman. And I think most men growing up today have a father or a brother or an uncle or someone who has been a victim of this.
When I talk to women about this, they all say things like this to me: “oh, you worry too much” or “you read too many books about divorce” or especially “when you meet the right girl, you’ll fall in love, and all this concern about atheistic feminist judges in the courts won’t stop you”. That last one is the most popular. And it’s always made me think that if this is how women see commitment – feelings-based – it’s no wonder that women initiate 70% of divorces.
I always thought it was a curse that I grew up poor and could not afford to show off my wealth in order to attract attention from women. Now I see that God actually gave me a great blessing. In order for a man to get married, it takes a lot more than finding the right girl. He needs to live in the right culture – a culture that tries to equip women to be content in committed relationships and treat men fairly.
I don’t think even women who claim to be pro-male and/or pro-marriage know or care how stories like this affect men. I’m very wealthy. I certainly do look at what is likely to happen if a woman goes to the courts expecting me to give her money. In fact, whenever I post stories on my wall about how the judges legislate from the bench to transfer money from men to women, there’s just silence or sometimes deflection by attacking men (except for my friend Dina who agrees with me). No one dares to speak up for men, it’s just expected that we be robbed by the government in order to make women happy. Because “marriage is for women”.
And as long as the message keeps being sent by judicial activists in the family courts, men will keep adjusting how they treat women. Women appear very unsafe to us, and nothing that’s going on in the courts is changing the trend towards avoidance. Men are very good at calculating risks vs rewards.
WINTERY KNIGHT 
This further demonstrates that the law has made it impossible to form a truly binding marriage covenant. I’ve been an advocate of fully privatizing the institution of marriage, but so long as the family remains a threat to government power, stories like this demonstrate that even leaving legal marriage out of the equation won’t protect you. Government will do whatever it takes to stop people from forming families.
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I wonder how many authentic, Christian men would trade their children they had with a wicked ex-wife just so they could have more fancy pants and lollipops. The regret is against being foolish and marrying the ex-wife to begin with, and not against the child(ren).
I think the statistics for Christian men with children that have been divorced unbiblically by their “Christian” ex-wife is exceptionally low considering how few personal accounts I can find online. I have found maybe two others that perhaps share a similar story of mine and I have been blogging about my experience quite extensively since the beginning of this year.
Also, the existence of an online, Christian, men divorce groups is almost non-existent, which leads me to believe that the percentages are just so low as to almost be irrelevant.
So, two things I have observed:
1) The risk of accidentally marrying a “Christian” woman that results in her unbiblically divorcing you is overblown. Yes, a risk, but it’s more about the person you marry than the system itself. You can find a woman with enough character that won’t “pull the trigger” no matter how tempting.
2) Having the children is still worth the loss of fancy pants and lollipops even if she does.
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Yes. I think the risk is easy to mitigate if you know what to ask her .
This post is more about the family courts though, and no amount of wisdom from the man will make those fair for men. It’s out of our control. The only smart play is not to play at all.
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“It’s out of our control. The only smart play is not to play at all.”
I would object with the term “only” as Apostle Paul does not even believe celibacy is for everyone during a time when Christians were getting murdered. I am assuming that marriage and children during Roman times are interchangeable since they probably did not believe in the pull-out method. We cannot claim that divorce courts are to the extreme level of persecution of Apostle Paul’s day.
Assuming one doesn’t have the gift of celibacy, then the only remaining option is to get married assuming Christian ethics.
What do you think is the risk profile for a Christian man today to mistakenly marry a Christian woman that eventually divorces him unbiblically?
1 out of 10? 1 out of 100? 1 out of 1,000?
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I cant tell if you’re being disingenuous or if you are just ignorant.
The fact that you don’t know many Christian men this has happened to is irrelevant. Your sample size is going to be too small for your anecdotal evidence to be statistically significant.
Whether children born out of a marriage are regretted by a Christian man after he is divorced is irrelevant to the articles topic. It is a red herring and a bizarre one at that.
The term ‘authentic Christian man’ is clearly the set up for a No True Scottsman fallacy.
‘Gift of celibacy,’ its called self control and it is a fruit of the spirit.
1 in 1000 odds (not born out by marriage/divorce rates) of losing a minimum of half your wealth and being sentenced to a potential life sentence of indentured servitude is terrible odds.
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@Earl of Grey
“I cant tell if you’re being disingenuous or if you are just ignorant.”
I’m far more versed than you know. https://blog.jeffersonkim.com/2020/09/when-fancy-pants-and-lollipops-are-more.html
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“The fact that you don’t know many Christian men this has happened to is irrelevant. Your sample size is going to be too small for your anecdotal evidence to be statistically significant.”
I attempted to find support groups and stories online of Christian husbands that fit my situation of being unbiblically divorced by a Christian wife. There is no better data readily available. If you are saying my data is bad, please provide better data.
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“Whether children born out of a marriage are regretted by a Christian man after he is divorced is irrelevant to the articles topic. It is a red herring and a bizarre one at that.”
It is relevant if you make the following conclusion as Wintery Knight does.
“I thought about it, and I thought that maybe it is better to not have married, especially when I read stories about how family courts trample over the rights of men to favor women, regardless of what the law says.”
“It’s out of our control. The only smart play is not to play at all.”
The fact that you cannot make the connection between marriage and having children is more bizarre. In Christian ethics, they are interchangeable as you cannot have one without the other. Historically speaking, it has always been the case.
To be clear, I am referring to religious marriage, but that is irrelevant as even the mere fact of cohabitation is enough to create a civil marriage by many laws.
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“The term ‘authentic Christian man’ is clearly the set up for a No True Scottsman fallacy.”
Only if I am unwilling to define that term. I am referring to a “Christian” man who does not believe in sex outside of marriage as commanded by God. I am referring to a Christian man who does not believe in divorce outside of adultery and physical abandonment as commanded by God. If a “Christian” man believes otherwise, then I am not referring to that “Christian” man and this discussion is irrelevant with that man.
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“1 in 1000 odds (not born out by marriage/divorce rates) of losing a minimum of half your wealth and being sentenced to a potential life sentence of indentured servitude is terrible odds.”
Every man makes his own risk calculations. You would need to place those odds next to all the other potential risks associated with raising children and being married.
I am not disputing that the courts are corrupt. I am disputing what a Christian man is to do in the face of such corruption.
1) I will dispute the likelihood of such an event for a discerning, Christian man.
2) I will dispute the low value many Christian Red Pillers put toward children. I am emphasizing that children are worth the risk and even those Christian men who have been through divorce, will still say they would not exchange any of their children to have more fancy pants and lollipops.
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The world would be a much darker place if Christian men cowered in fear toward the evil, worldly powers and stopped having children that they raised to be Godly.
I will pose a question: between celibacy and marriage, what is your third-option that fits in with Christian ethics?
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I totally agree that the courts are very anti-male when it comes to family matters! The only exceptions I’ve seen are when the men are Muslim.
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Yeah, Ontario allows Muslim men to marry up to 4 women and collect welfare for all 4 of them. Insane, but that’s multiculturalism.
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🤬
I’ve had personal involvement with one family and spent many times in court. It was very disheartening. Ultimately, the children involved were forced to live with their abusive father. It wasn’t until they were older and finally found the courage to tell him they were Christian (he had forced them back into Islam and to claim they were forced to become Christian while he was out of the country). He didn’t want them anymore. Thankfully, their (apostate) mother was able to get accessible housing and they now live with her, but the damage to those girls is devastating.
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That’s crazy but these are the people in charge.
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A female judge to boot.
I’m seeing so many horrible decisions being made by dem-fems in power. I read the Ann Coulter column about Jake Gardner and both US reps were women.
Yettttt, my male-only church leadership is all about women power, except for the church. They get such positive feedback by saying, “let the best person win.” Reeking havoc by what they support but don’t see it because they hold the line on elders and pastors.
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Yesm I think my point is that the good women who are conservative, love apologetics, chastity and sobriety better realize that the feminists are making it impossible for them to find husbands. Men are learning from the abuses of the secular leftist women in the courts. If good women want husband’s, they’d better start fighting for their future husbands.
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I wouldn’t advise any man marry these days, and any involvement now is risky. Celibacy may not be very appealing, but it beats the alternatives most men find themselves in now, like divorced and living like a pauper to keep ex wifeypoo in her accustomed style, like trapped in a miserable marriage…..that in spite of its being a marriage does not at all honor God, regardless of what the tradcons say.
Better to concentrate on being the best person you can be for God where you find yourself. 1 Corinthians 7:27: “Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife.”
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This is my current plan, but I would marry several of my female advisors anyway, if I had met them around age 25, they’re that good.
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I’ve enjoyed the back and forth here and I think there are good arguments all around. But I would still insist that marriage is a good thing for most men and as regards Christian men, quite an honorable calling. Certainly, WK, I’m not suggesting you disagree, but instead fear the negative potentials attached to the practice. I say, to hell with those potential pitfalls. I would not wager against you finding a woman who sees the institution as you do and then living with her happily ever after. After all, you wouldn’t be diving in within a week of meeting her, would you? And given your history, a long engagement wouldn’t be a problem for you, so test driving isn’t a concern. Only getting to know each other will fill whatever length of time your engagement lasts. My wife and I were together seven and a half years before tying the knot over 30 years ago. Though we did “indulge”, that period left us with little doubt about with whom each of us was dealing. I see no possibility of anything but death separating us. Why would you be at any greater risk than I?
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Again, its a matter of probability. A cost benefit analysis. The CDC reports the divorce rate among Protestants (when accounting across all denominations) to be about 51%. 70% of divorces are initiated by women. You stand to lose half your wealth, become indebted, lose your ability to raise your children in a godly manner, and have your earnings garnished for the rest of your life.
Men are not avoiding marriage so they can have “fancy pants and lolipops,” whatever that means. They are protecting themselves and refusing to invest in an immoral and ungodly legal system.
I am glad there are godly couples in the body of christ who have been married for 30 + years. However, a lot has changed in the last 50 years in both our society and the church.
Male shaming tactics won’t get your daughters married. Church princess culture and right wing feminism has chased men out of the church.
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@Earl Of Grey
You have no understanding of probability.
Am I the first Christian man with kids you know of that has been divorced unbiblically?
Refer me to the testimony of Christian men with kids who have been divorced unbiblically. Send me the link. I’d like to read them. I’ve been searching since I was divorced last year in January. (this goes for anyone that reads this post. Please send me the links!)
If the probability was so high, where are the Christian divorced dads support groups that I’ve been desperately trying to find?
Why am I one of the few, rare examples that testifies of the thing you most dread?
And even when I am the one few Christian men who testifies of what you fear the most, why am I still declaring that having the children was worth the pain?
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Probability is the mathematical description of how likely an event is to occur. A divorce rate for a particular demographic
describes how likely that group is to get divorced.
Your are not the first man I know with kids to get unbiblically divorced.
The fact you can’t find internet testimony of men who have had similar experiences or support groups doesnt indicate anything other than our cultures (christian church culture) disdain for men who get divorced. Men in the church who get divorced are often treated as if it is their fault, or as perpetrators. While women get treated as victims who deserve ‘gods best.’
Whether you declare having children was worth the pain has no bearing on whether the current legal system is immoral.
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@Earl of Grey
“Your are not the first man I know with kids to get unbiblically divorced.
The fact you can’t find internet testimony of men who have had similar experiences or support groups doesnt indicate anything other than our cultures (christian church culture) disdain for men who get divorced. Men in the church who get divorced are often treated as if it is their fault, or as perpetrators. While women get treated as victims who deserve ‘gods best.’
Prove it. Send me the links to their testimonies. It doesn’t stop people from congregating and creating online communities anonymously as you are right now.
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“Whether you declare having children was worth the pain has no bearing on whether the current legal system is immoral.”
Your inability to understand the argument I communicated to you in detail is alarming. As a result, I concede and am in complete agreement with you that you should never get married or have children.
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“If the probability was so high, where are the Christian divorced dads support groups that I’ve been desperately trying to find?”
Um the thing your missing when you say that is that women LOVE to play the victim and men HATE to go there. That is why you are having difficulty find divorced dads support groups. So I have no doubt at all that there are LOTS of divorced dads out there. Guys just hate to play the victim (this implicitly means admitting FAILURE). Try starting up your own divorced dads support group and you may find yourself with your hands FULL…
And for the record I personally know (in Québec) at least 10 Christian guys divorced with kids by a wife with no biblical motive. I had first-row seats to one of these divorces as one of these guys had just lost a 2 year old kid to brain cancer. Just after the funeral his wife told him “I need you out of the house for a while as I need to sort things out”. I took him in at my place. One morning we were having breakfast and heard someone knocking at the door. WHO could be knocking at the door around 7:30AM?? It was a court clerk serving my friend divorce papers. His “good Christian” wife got him out of the house so she could plan her divorce… Later on his kids found their mother in bed with a biker…
But about the courts, I VERY much suspect that the politicians/lawyers in the 60s that initiated the changes to marriage laws DELIBERATELY did so to wreck marriages AND undermine paternal authority… A concept that is now heresy for the postmodern elites that hold power now…
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paternal authority… A concept that is now heresy for the postmodern elites that hold power now…
And heresy for the “church,” too.
To anyone who starts a support group for frivorced Christian fathers, know that you will not only get no help whatsoever from any established church, but you might very well find yourself in its crosshairs. The ugly reality today is that men who seek the restoration of godly patriarchy will essentially have to form their own church – which is something that forming a frivorced Christian men’s support group might be doing. At a time when Churchianity, Inc. is coming apart at the seams after being exposed for the fragile artifice that it is (thank you, Covidiocy!), groups such as this just might be one manifestation of the True Church that arises to replace it. May God bless and strengthen whoever takes that first step.
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