Laura from Pursuing Holiness has concerns about Mike Huckabee. (H/T Foxfier)
She writes in part:
In defiance of libertarian laissez-faire, Huckabee has extended his Christian vision to include the poor. “If there are a certain number of kids from single-parent homes who aren’t going to school and don’t have health care, you can say that’s not government’s job,” Huckabee told me. “Well, sweet and fine! But you know what? If the kid’s sitting outside the door of the hospital choking with asthma, do I sit there and say, ‘Oh, I’m sorry, I don’t think, philosophically, government should get involved’? I’d much rather the kid get help than I sit around and say I’m so pure in my ideology.”
I actually don’t think that Huckabee is even a real Republican or a real Christian. Not only is he a crappy tax-raising, amnesty-granting, big government socialist, but I don’t think he isn’t even a Bible-believing Christian.
Consider this in John 14:6:
6Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
And this in Acts 4:12:
12Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”
Look what Huckster says:
Other members of the group politely admitted that they had no doubt that most Israelis, and anyone else who had not accepted Christ as Lord and Saviour, would be spending eternity in Hell. (“That is an issue,” a man named Randy Rebold told me apologetically.) Huckabee’s formulation is considerably more politic. “If somebody asked me, How do I get to Heaven, I would tell them that the only way I personally am aware of is faith in Christ, because I believe the New Testament,” he said. “That’s the only map I got. Somebody says, Well, I got a different map. O.K.! You know what? If it works, I’m not going to argue with you.”
That’s not Christianity. That’s relativism. He doesn’t even have the map he thinks he has.
WINTERY KNIGHT 
A good Christian response might even be:
I do not claim to know what God will or will not, in his infinite mercy, do. I believe speculation about who will be going to hell is sinful– a sin against the Holy Spirit, against the God who can forgive all sins.
The relativism is pretty…ouch. From a PREACHER?!?!
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You don’t think the government should help a child choking with asthma?
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If you are talking about pollution, then that reining that in is a legitimate function of government.
Now my turn. Do you think that the government-run schools should procure abortions for students without notifying the child’s parents?
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No I don’t. I think that’s horrific. I don’t see abortion as a ‘health service’ in the slightest. It should never be treated as such.
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The asthma thing has a third, proper solution:
get off your self-righteous tail and help the kid yourself.
THAT is the correct, Christ-like answer.
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I just assumed he was talking about pollution, but your answer was my first answer. It’s like people have forgotten to take care of the people around them. Instead, they can’t be bothered by the needs of others and they want government to take care of everything – with someone else’s money.
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Interesting thread.
Would you pay all the kid’s bills? Take him/her in if he/she had no home without asking the government to reimburse you for same?
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Irrelevant.
Very telling that that logical fallacy springs up when you point out the false choice, but still irrelevant.
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Thanks, Foxfier.
Basically, what I understand MCS to be saying that if free people do not use their freedom and prosperity to remove every last speck of human evil and suffering (and inequality of wealth) on the face of the planet, then free people should give up all our liberty and money to the government and let the government try to solve the problem, regardless of what results they achieve. She wins by default because she doesn’t have to prove anything about whether her utopian solution is actually effective.
But government doesn’t even do any of the wealth creating that allows people to take care of the needs of their neighbor.
What we need to do is compare the state of the poor here with the state of the poor in North Korea and Zimbabwe, where communism is embraced. How are the poor doing there in countries like that? Is it Heaven on Earth, with equality for all? I think not.
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It’s a side point, but Zim is not communist. It’s a fascist dictatorship. Mugabe rules.
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I stand corrected. I just assumed that there was no free market, private property, etc. there based on what I had read.
Things like this Reuters article.
Excerpt:
When I hear “state monopoly” on news, I think communism. Multiple private newspapers in competition operating with few or no regulations? That’s free market capitalism.
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Actually, no, WIntery. I can see that Foxfier believes we should all take care of our brethren, be good Samaritans. I was merely asking her in what manner she was suggesting it be done, starting with her own example. That is hardly irrelevant, in less, of course, she does not think her own example is worthy to be followed.
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You need to read a bit more carefully. I said nothing about my views of the proper thing to do; I pointed out the Christ-like thing to do.
I suspect you are being disingenuous in your attempt to shift the grounds of the argument, and I frankly refuse to accept a change of topic from Mr. Huckabee to myself, because
1) it’s not relevant to the topic, as truth is truth no matter who says it (You are employing a variation of the logical fallacy “ad hominim”– argument against the person rather than the topic.)
2) it’s none of your business
and
3) it’s a very tired old dodge when someone can’t make an argument.
If you can’t make a logical argument for your view, that’s your problem. Not mine.
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So it’s OK for you to suggest that Huckabee should be a good Samaritan, but it’s not OK for me to suggest that you do the same? Sounds a bit self-righteous, Foxfier. And that ain’t irrelevant, not in a blog in which you and the OP are judging whether Huckabee is a true Christian.
Ever hear this one: Judge not, lest ye be judged?
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Yes I blogged about that.
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Again, you fail to show that you are even trying to read what is actually there. Again, you try to change the subject to me– oddly, NOT my favorite subject, old jokes aside.
I’ll wait for you to state and support an argument on the actual topic.
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I’m sorry, Foxfier. WHere is the rule saying I have to have an argument in order to ask you to clarify your position? You are the first poster, after all. As such, your views are pertinent to the entire post–and my response to it.
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You’re not asking me to clarify my position, you’re trying to change the topic.
The topic isn’t me, it is Huckabee and acting Christian.
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Let me try this again. You seem to be saying that Huckabee is not a real Christian for advocating that government services are the lesser of two evils where helping the poor is concerned. Huckabee is saying that it’s better to be compassionate instead of theologically correct. It is at this point that you offer “a third proper solution: get off your self-righteous tail and help the kid yourself. THAT is the correct, Christ-like answer.”
My question as to whether or not you’d be willing to do the same was not impertinent. Anyone who accuses someone else of being both “not a real Christian” and “self-righteous” must have a strong basis for judging. I am merely asking you to share yours.
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There are two problems with Huckabee.
1) He wants to take money from Christian taxpayers which they can use on the things they value within their worldview, like private schools or homeschooling, and hand it to a secular leftist government to spend on things like free abortions, because he believes that the decision-making power of a secular leftist government is superior to the decision-making power of Christian taxpayers who EARN the money by the sweat of their own brow in the first place. This doesn’t necessarily make him a non-Christian – he might instead be an incredibly IGNORANT and INEFFECTIVE Christian person, with as much knowledge of God’s existence and character as my keyboard. If you want to know what Christians think money is for, crack open your Bible and read the book of Philippians. It takes about 15 minutes.
2) He thinks that all religions are equally valid, something that is expressly forbidden in the Bible in about a MILLION locations. This necessarily means that he is not a Christian. No Christian can deny the universality of sin and the need for a Savior to atone for the price of sin. He is about as Christian as Obama.
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Huckabee is saying that it’s better to be compassionate instead of theologically correct.
No, he isn’t.
He’s saying that the options are let the kid choke, or get help– from the context, help from the government, and under color of it being the “Christian” thing to do. This is a false choice, and avoids the actual sort of actions Christ took.
By making this false choice and implying that those who do not support nanny-state support systems would let a child die, he is engaging in self-righteous actions.
By the way, you apparently didn’t read WK’s post on judging, and you seem to have me confused with him. I think Huck’s a Christian, I just think he’s misguided and not a politician I would support.
My question as to whether or not you’d be willing to do the same was not impertinent
Yes, it is. It doesn’t matter if I’m Buddhist or an atheist, if I am correct about what actions are Christ like.
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What does that tell you about the ability of “real Christians,” as you describe them, to get elected? Can you name a couple who uphold the values you espouse that are viable candidates for office?
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Well Christ would have healed the kid, don’t you think?
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Highly probable.
So, what does that tell us about the actions he would take?
He would do something himself to the best of his ability.
Not ignore someone in need, and not try to find someone else to do it.
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If we’re not going to heal those in need, then perhaps we should all seriously consider doing what Jesus said: sell all our belongings and give them to the poor.
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Just FYI Foxfier, MCS is a Christian Scientist (Mary Baker Eddy cult) and believes in healing powers today. And she definitely tilts left on politics.
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Leftward? Never would have imagined. *dry*
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What’s so leftward about asking whether you take Jesus at his word? Oh wait. It’s that “giving to the poor” bit. Right?
I guess Jesus tilted leftward, too.
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No, I mean stuff on your blog.
Giving to the poor is fine if you do it with your own money. See you ‘re bad, you wouldn’t even read philippians. It’s about charitable giving to send Paul on missionary trips to tell people about Jesus. That’s GOOD. Giving government money to so they can give it to ACORN for voter faud? That’s BAD.
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Who said anything about giving money to ACORN? Geez Wintery, get a grip.
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It’s not the content, but the context.
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Just curious, W. What is your reading on that statement in the new testament? You and I have disagreed over Jesus paying taxes, but how do you read that one?
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I think it’s obligatory to pay taxes. And if the taxes are used for a nasty purpose like killing innocent unborn babies to free up the adults who made her, then the person has to decide whether to leave, stop working, etc., to avoid participating in it. Taxpayer-funded IVF is similiar – you’re paying people to have fatherless babies – which is child abuse.
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Wintery! You’re being absolutely lobsterific here. C’mon. Don’t pull a Glenn on me or I’m going to have to heal you of something.
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I don’t think Huckabee’s comment was that convoluted. Sorry.
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Fine by me.
If you want to object to my view, though, you’ll have to do more than “I don’t think so.”
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